My "non-sense" comments after reading 20 other "sensible" comments in above linked article of my favorite Naveen Naqvi:
I was looking for a solution. Finally found here in your concluding note in reference to DAWN editorial.
*There are no good/bad Talibans. And as Timothy simply suggested kill all Monsters before they kill Pakistan. But for sure, before they are vanished, they will attempt to kill as many Army related personnel and ordinary Pakistanis – how we expect from them to play by book and observe Islamic principles? – it is too naive to expect all this decency from a declared monster. We have declared Islam of Taliban is not the right brand and we also expect them to observe sanctity of mosques when back-lashing to their cleansing program.
*All Jihadis have common agenda so militant groups targeting Kashmir should be also killed (mere disbanding does not work) and their Punjabi cousins (aka Punjabi Talibans) should be drone attacked since they all are supporting each other.
*No one mentioned here, but all Islamic madrassas should be closed immediately across the board since these are nurseries of future sympathizers of militant groups if not go step ahead and join them.
*all the personnel in armed forces or government institutions who have a trace of any soft corner for monsters should be persecuted in Abu Gharib or Gitmo type jails
*All religious leaders who don’t come on TV, same day as any back-lash incident happens, to strongly condemn the monsters should be exiled to a place called Ko Kaf so they can dance with fairies as a practice opportunity before these blessed souls dance in heaven with Hoors.
*If possible, Ata Turk type of Islam should be introduced in Pakistan. Pervaiz Musharraf had a plan but this desire of his was jeopardized by ill-planned 9/11. We should all support Marvi memon who is doing her best for his re-incarnation. So he can come in power once again to fulfill his Ata Turkise Pakistan dream.
All of the above should happen before “strong” Talibans attack me or kill Pakistan. Looks like – Do more – appeals are only being listened by monsters and for Rahman Malik – it is – Do More – Negligence so monsters can penetrate the “most secured” place at their will.
Can we kill Monsters having a Clan ruling us? Of that clan, he is the Shining Star? If someone expects that, then we deserve a place in Fool’s paradise more than a monster deserves.
The choice is ours – to speedy kill the monsters and send them to fool’s paradise or get bomb blasted and reach there before monster arrives.
I am feeling myself very wise after writing this “rant shant” and dying to appear on a TV talk show or at least on LBS(laid back show of faisal kapadia) to spill out my wisdom and impress the nation by my grasp on this grave situation and a way out.
Who said Jokers don’t exist in Chaos time? But they are called “Intellectuals” in crisis time and comment on blogs in free time as ‘Lucky Irani Circus’ is closed due to security reasons.
P.S – if I sound insane, then join me as any one expecting sanity in these turmoils (Fasad fil Ardh) is an insane without any doubt.
Tmphuk Mobiles
ReplyDelete@Naveen, no offence intended, but you and your contempories have clearly misused the term 'Frankensteins'.
Just for the record, in Mary Shelly's Frankenstein, Frankenstein was the scientisit who creates the monster who is left nameless and is correctly referred to as Frankenstein's monster.
Hence, you cannot refer to the 'different Taliban Factions' as an 'army of Frankensteins'. Frankenstein would be a suitable name for the 'establishment' that created these so-called 'monsters'.... See More
20 hours ago
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Tmphuk Mobiles
It is regretful that you show so much complacency in making such sweeping generalisations about the Taliban, not to disimilar to generalisations that have been perpetuated by the 'creators' of these same fellow human beings.
Today at 3:42am
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Tmphuk Mobiles
ReplyDeleteThere is some similitude in the story of the Taliban and Frankenstein.
Victor Frankenstein played God and learns how to create life from dead flesh, in fact he creates a monster without a name!
The US, the Pak Gov and Army assist in creating the 'Taliban' to fight the Russians.... See More
Frankenstein's is in awe of his 'supreme' powers of creativity, which makes him lose sight of his responsibility to this creature .
He not only fails to nurture it and care for it, but instead uses it to fulfill his own selfish desires. Victor is the real monster; Victor's plans take a wrong turn when the creature he so very much wants to control and impose his will upon, turns against him and kills the ones closest to him.
The unnamed creature had the potential to be a kind and loving being to all mankind if he was treated humanely!
The Taliban were worthy victors and remained an ally of both the 'anti communist west' and Pak, until 911.
The peace and security of life that the Taliban regime brought to Afghanistan under God's supreme law was intolerable to the 'secular and democratic' rest of the world.
Afghanistan was no longer going to be economically enslaved by taking interest bearing loans from the rest of the world!
The heroin supply to the West was going to be cut!
The children would be taught to worship the Creator, instead of creation. They would be taught disipline and respect instead of immorality!
The west would no longer be able to export its capitalism, cooruption and immorality to Afghanistan!
Many of my newly acquired business acquaintances in the early part of this decade after the invasion and illegal occupation of Afghanistan were from amongst the Sikh community who had lived in Afghanistan for centuries, but were eventually forced to emmigrate to London, amongst other places.
Many of them would recall the best of times they enjoyed under the 'Taliban'.
They admit that they had a difficult, but bearable existence in a war ravaged country during the Afghan-Russian conflict.
These same non-muslim Sikhs speak of a time of peace and prosperity when the Taliban took control of over most of Afghanistan between 1996 and 2001.
These Sikhs often mention that 'Under the Taliban' they had SECURITY OF LIFE and their WOMAN WERE TREATED RESPECTFULLY, what else could you ask for to live a peaceful life.
But many, including the Muslims in the rest of the World would like to form their opinions on the lies of the Media, without any verification or identification of the reliability of the sources.
The US invasion and imposition of 'democracy' under the leadership of US puppet Karzai enslaved the country once again and the Sikhs and the Muslims who eventually escaped the country tell stories of indiscriminate killings, women being abducted and sold to the highest bidders, rampant immorality, injustices, etc. etc.
These injustices continue, even after the west have themselves identified the exceptionally high levels of corruption of the 'NEWEST DEMOCRATIC' governemnt that they themsleves have imposed. The amount of vote rigging to keep Karzai in charge is another thing.
Today at 4:17am
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ReplyDeleteTmphuk Mobiles
As far as the different factions of 'taliban' causing death and carnage in Pakistan are concerned, the main and sole beneficiaries of such actions are the Pak Gov and Army who are the recipients of an endless supply of dollars to help fight the US's illegal war.
Are we so ignorant to believe that the government is concerned about our welfare. Can... See More... See More these same politicans be trusted to be just and fair while they fill their own coffers and their children reap the benefits of a safe haven and the best of education in foreign lands.
Most of these so-called factions of the'taliban' are neither the Taliban nor nameless, but they are an extension of our gov and army, being paid by them to create this disorder we find ourselves in today.
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Samir Rana
wonder why we are getting no more feeddback on this post. is it because @tmphuk mobiles's comments are not relevant, or no one has any answers to this criticism. I thinkit is most important that the issues raised by naveen and @tmphuk mobiles's persceptions be further explored. after all this is what media is all about.
someone please say that @tmphuk mobiles is wrong or otherwise.
kudos to naveen for her boldness in bringing the issue in light.
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Mohammed Mohsin Meer
Tmphuk Mobiles and all others are right to some extent. That is why we have this big mess and total confusion. All are partially right and partially wrong but assuming they are totally right and others totally wrong. That is why we are stuck and no exit out. We all need to sit together and have a win-win consensus for the sake of saving Pakistan. ... See MoreAll these games only if there is Pakistan, otherwise a different ball field and totally different game where all the current champions will be future losers.
47 minutes ago ·
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Naveen - Samir is quite right asking for your feedback on comments. I know you are enjoying the recognition wave but need to spare some time to reply on your reader's queries/comments seeking clarifications.
Tmphuk - Talibans are Frankenstein in a sense that America is their creator after USSR (of that time) decided to leave Afghanistan and there ... See Morewas a civil war type situation. To control that war among warlords and different Jihadi groups, US with the help of ISI and SA, "created" and supported Talibans to defeat all groups and come in power. The same talibans betrayed the Creator by not handing over Osama to US after 9/11. That was the start of their Frankenstein role.
I hope this explanation will convince you that Naveen used this terminology in the right sense.
10 minutes ago ·
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Tmphuk Mobiles - I just read your all comments and it seems you have all the answers. Wonder why don't you write an analytical piece yourself. I have requested you to add me as a facebook friend. I like to interact with you more if you are on twitter or have your own blog. We can learn a lot from each other by exchanging our opinions on current issues in region. The same offer to Mr. Samir Rana.
Tmphuk Mobiles
ReplyDelete@Samir, my dear brother, how possibly can my comments be irrelevant?
I have attempted to explain how Naveen has wrongly labelled the 'taliban' as Frankenstein instead of using it for the 'creator' of the 'monster' as originally used in the novel by the author Mary Shelly.
Yesterday at 1:46am · Report
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Tmphuk Mobiles
As far as being right or wrong, I endevour to make sure the information I present is verifiable and comes from more the one relaible source.
I don't necessarily believe everything I read, hear or see, especially if it is put out on mass media!
Perpetuating this myth that the 'Taliban' are responsible for all forms of terrorism here and abroad is typical of the Media, including the Press towing the Governement line, showing just how 'FREE' the press really is!... See More
Allah (SWT) says in the Qur'an: "Oh you who believe! If a faasiq (sinner, liar or evil person) comes to you with any news, verify it, lest you should harm people in ignorance, and afterwards you become regretful for what you have done." (al-hujurat, 49:6)
Yesterday at 1:55am · Report
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Tmphuk Mobiles
@Mohsin, my dear brother, i know its not a big thing, but the term Frankenstein is constantly being used out of context here. The author Mary Shelly used this fictional name in her novel for the character who was the CREATOR and not the monster!
I have never claimed to have all the answers. All I desire is that people should have an open mind and verify information before they try to pass it of as facts.
Yesterday at 3:12am · Report
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Tmphuk Mobiles
ReplyDeleteThe Taliban rightfully and most courageously demanded evidence linking Osama to 9/11 before they were going to hand him over to 'FRANKENSTEIN'.
On the 28th of September 2001, 17 days after 911 Osama Bin Ladin declared the following in a statement:-
"I have already said that I am not involved in the 11 September attacks in the United States. As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. I had no knowledge of these attacks, nor do I consider the killing of innocent women, children and... See More other humans as... See More an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people. Such a practice is forbidden even in the course of a battle. . . . [W]e are against the American system, not against its people, whereas in these attacks, the common American people have been killed."... See More
Osama bin Laden Responsible for the 9/11 Attacks?
Is This Belief Based on Evidence?
By David Ray Griffin
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article23862.htm
'
Yesterday at 3:26am · Report
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Tmphuk Mobiles
If the Pakistanis had Osama, they would have made the evidence up themselves and sold him over a thousand times without any sense of justice or morals.
Musharif has clearly stated in his autobiography that his gov and army recieved millions of dollars for capturing and handing over hundreds of taliban/terrorists to the US.
Many out of the over 700 'enemy combatants' that were illegally detained for as many as 7 years at Gitmo after being tortured into giving false confessions in secret prisons in Pakistan, Baghram and other countries have since been released without charge!... See More
It seems that the Pak gov and army will even sell their daughters, sisters and mothers as in the case of Dr Aafia Siddiqui. What dignity and honour have we got left to protect!
Wasn't it the US Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage who warned Lt. Gen. Mahmud Ahmed, head of ISI, Pakistan’s intelligence service, the US would “bomb Pakistan back to the Stone Age” if it did not immediately turn against its Afghan ally, Taliban, and allow the US to use military bases in Pakistan to invade Afghanistan?
ISI sources say the Bush Administration threatened to bomb faithful old ally Pakistan, cut off its oil, collapse its banking system, and call in its loans. More frightening, Washington also threatened to “unleash” India against Pakistan, either allowing India to conquer the Pakistani-held portion of disputed Kashmir, or give Delhi a green light to invade all of Pakistan, possibly with American assistance....
Yesterday at 3:55am · Report
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Tmphuk Mobiles
The 'Taliban' in Afghanistan brought peace and SECURITY OF LIFE to the people of Afghanistan. I know of academics, engineers, professionals that moved to the region to help build the infrastructure, they took their whole families there with the view of building a better future...but the West had other plans...they could not tolerate even one country in the world to be governed by Shariah.
Yesterday at 4:14am · Report
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Mohammed Mohsin Meer
ReplyDelete100% agree with all you said, my friend Tmphuk Mobiles! I wonder where you have been so far in this totally confused world. Please join Twitter also and visit
http://twitter.com/mohsin2016
We need more of your wisdom and benefit from your right approach. The rest are all noises. ... See More
Visit my blogs also. They are in teething stage but since we are on same wave length, you will like some of my comments.
http://2tok.blogspot.com/
http://kopyrite.blogspot.com/
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Samir Rana
unfortunately people holding views as expressed by @tmphuk are considered to be 'extremists', 'conspiracy theorists', etc.
my point is that there are a considerable number of people who do perceive differently. we all are forced to believe on what media 'educates' us (i am not delving into whether media is right or wrong). there are different ways of expressing the same thing e.g. different newspapers express the same news according to their policies........none is wrong. the same news is then interpreted at different levels......people like us coming from various backgrounds interpret a certain news according to our own circumstances.
a good media integrates all this. its actually the voice of many on one platform.
naveen's article does cater to a certain audience and same is true for @tmphuk's perceptions. naveen's article focuses on the 'monsters' created by different governments to fight on certain agendas and @tmphuk and mohsin are discussing, actually the origin of taliban.
i must say the answer lies somewhere in between? its very important for our country to gain stability. and it has to be our effort.......not an effort dictated by any authority which we are forced to accept.... See More
i implore the people who have the capacity now to spread out the word, like people working in media, to hear out everyone. no voice is un-important today because we are the ones who are living it all. no one's irrelevant. lets put all our worries, and conflicts on the table. let us be tolerant and if we think the other needs to know more, lets teach each other in a civil manner!
Yesterday at 1:07pm · Report
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Mohammed Mohsin Meer
Samir; Agree that -- {{i must say the answer lies somewhere in between? its very important for our country to gain stability. and it has to be our effort.......not an effort dictated by any authority which we are forced to accept.... }}
The solution is always in-between. A win-win situation or as the old saying - Live and Let Live. There can be no permanent peace by ethnic cleansing of Pakhtoons in the name of killing bad Talibans.
There will be no clear cut winners of present Afghan crisis. But Pakistan will be a sure loser by all means. US will blame all their failures on Pakistan before they finally evacuate the place as announced in 2011.... See More
Talibans may bounce back and resume power by popular vote. TMphuk has narrated some actual facts about Taliban era. I was impressed how quickly they restored peace in country, improved law and order and made the country poppy free. Now under the US and it's puppet Karzai, the country is again #1 producer of poppy - base product of Heroin drug.
The truth can be suppressed, delayed and hindered but for a little time - it will prevail in the end.
Yesterday at 7:16pm · Delete · Report
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Mohammed Mohsin Meer
Are you guys following discussion (comments) on the original blog?
http://naveenaqvi.com/2009/12/05/army-of-frankensteins/#comment-174
Yesterday at 7:28pm · Delete · Report
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Tmphuk Mobiles
ReplyDelete@Mohsn interesting analysis and ideas. Nice to see that we share some of the same thoughts.
The following comments by Timothy Thomson earlier in the blog are typical of how the media is being manipulated and people 'indoctrinated' in playing the blame game an in particular Taliban bashing. Death and destruction will continue as long as we support the illegal war and occupation of Afghanistan, Iraq, Palestine,etc.
... See More
'Top with Saudi indoctrination which comes bound to their money. What one gets is a lethal monster which kills every 'INFIDEL' in sight. Unless people adhere to the monsters’ very narrow definition of Islam, they are non-Believers, just so much fodder for explosives.' ... See More
'This ends when all the Taliban movements are defeated or when Pakistan accedes to a Taliban Emirate. Pakistan kills the monsters or the monsters kill Pakistan.'
Yvonne Ridley was an 'INFIDEL' when she was captured by the Taliban, just prior to the US invasion who thought she was a spy, . She was an investigative journalist who admitted to ilegally enter Afghanistan for an undercover assignment to show the rest of the world the 'cruelty and barbarism 'of the 'Taliban'.
She was eventually released by the 'monsters' and subsequently accepted Islam a couple of years later.
Its quite ironic that this same revert is at the forefront of the struggle to get Dr Aafia released from the US (FRANKENSTEIN) who are allowing the frequent systematic rape of this innocent women.
Isn't it shameful that, how the US's henchmen the Pakistanis sold her to the US. What do we expect other then death and destruction if we so easily sell our HONOUR.
Talk by Yvonne Ridley about her experience of the TALIBAN:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PT9Wsh-vMX8
Who are the Taliban?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6wbrw8uthM&feature=related
about an hour ago · Report
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Mohammed Mohsin Meer
Tmphuk - Brother - They try to bury the voices like Yvonne Ridley by their FOX noises. You won't believe or world will reject the idea at knee jerk as conspiracy theory that 9/11 was merely and purposely created to topple the just government of Taliban in Afghanistan as it had started showing wonder results for the Afghan society which are only ... See Morewritten in history books for Prophet and his Right Guided caliphs. If world was allowed to see this Riba free Crime free Drugs free society at the hands of "illiterates" by world standard people, then whole world would have asked for the wonder recipe - ISLAM.
It is the fear of Islam - not of Muslims which has prompted so much Chaos in world. Bush and Dick Chenny were mere puppets on chain to act as per THE SCRIPT.
18 minutes ago · Delete · Report
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